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 Post subject: Evo X suspension
PostPosted: 28 Mar 2013 09:53 
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so as we all know, Only coilovers from Evo1-3 will fit Gen1s and Gen2s bla bla bla....

Evo4-9 has a different kind of lower mounting point so to fix that, we have to get custom rear arms which nobody(almost nobody) has attempted to do yet.

Picture is of the rear coilover from Ohlins R/T for Evo X. Why i am posting this pic.. i think its self explanatory :lol:

Anyone can double confirm?

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 Post subject: Re: Evo X suspension
PostPosted: 29 Mar 2013 08:15 
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Samurai Blues wrote:
Evo4-9 has a different kind of lower mounting point so to fix that, we have to get custom rear arms which nobody(almost nobody) has attempted to do yet.

Its been done but its easier to weld the bush carrier from a std gen1/2 shock onto a EVO4-9 shock, been done by loads of UK road rally competitors

Samurai Blues wrote:
Picture is of the rear coilover from Ohlins R/T for Evo X. Why i am posting this pic.. i think its self explanatory :lol:

Anyone can double confirm?

They do fit physically but are way too long (110mm longer IIRC) danger of bottoming the shocks on full bump and will be using the end of the shocks travel not the central part that should be used.


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 Post subject: Re: Evo X suspension
PostPosted: 29 Mar 2013 12:20 
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Sack of Spuds wrote:
Its been done but its easier to weld the bush carrier from a std gen1/2 shock onto a EVO4-9 shock, been done by loads of UK road rally competitors


Yucks. Is that reliable? You say loads of UK road rally competitors, which means its proven that they can take a beating but i am not quite comfortable with the idea; having to weld the bush carrier at such a high stress point?

Sack of Spuds wrote:
They do fit physically but are way too long (110mm longer IIRC) danger of bottoming the shocks on full bump


So the rears will fit? Even the top mounts? 110mm longer even after being lowered to the maximum, as compared to a coilover meant for the Gen2? I do no quite get what you mean by your statement. how would you have "danger of bottoming the shocks on full bump" if they are way too long?

Sack of Spuds wrote:
and will be using the end of the shocks travel not the central part that should be used.


Again, you mean when the coilovers are adjusted to the minimum ride height, yes? But the Ohlins R/T design has ride height adjustability separated from the spring collar (as with other more expensive designs like Tein Driving Flex & Monoflex) so should that still be an issue?

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 Post subject: Re: Evo X suspension
PostPosted: 29 Mar 2013 12:48 
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Samurai Blues wrote:
Sack of Spuds wrote:
Its been done but its easier to weld the bush carrier from a std gen1/2 shock onto a EVO4-9 shock, been done by loads of UK road rally competitors


Yucks. Is that reliable? You say loads of UK road rally competitors, which means its proven that they can take a beating but i am not quite comfortable with the idea; having to weld the bush carrier at such a high stress point?

Sack of Spuds wrote:
They do fit physically but are way too long (110mm longer IIRC) danger of bottoming the shocks on full bump


So the rears will fit? Even the top mounts? 110mm longer even after being lowered to the maximum, as compared to a coilover meant for the Gen2? I do no quite get what you mean by your statement. how would you have "danger of bottoming the shocks on full bump" if they are way too long?

Sack of Spuds wrote:
and will be using the end of the shocks travel not the central part that should be used.


Again, you mean when the coilovers are adjusted to the minimum ride height, yes? But the Ohlins R/T design has ride height adjustability separated from the spring collar (as with other more expensive designs like Tein Driving Flex & Monoflex) so should that still be an issue?



I was talking about the standard EVO X shocks versus standard Gen1/2 ones they are 110mm (IIRC) taller - anyway I gave upi trying to use them they were way too hard for a lightweight FWD car and coilovers will only be worse.

Why not just buy some correct fitment ones - anything with and EVO X label is way over priced at the moment. I have 2 sets (not for sale) of low mileage EVO Ohlins bought for peanuts off low mileage imported JDM cars.


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 Post subject: Re: Evo X suspension
PostPosted: 29 Mar 2013 17:30 
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Sack of Spuds wrote:
I was talking about the standard EVO X shocks versus standard Gen1/2 ones they are 110mm (IIRC) taller - anyway I gave upi trying to use them they were way too hard for a lightweight FWD car and coilovers will only be worse.

Why not just buy some correct fitment ones - anything with and EVO X label is way over priced at the moment. I have 2 sets (not for sale) of low mileage EVO Ohlins bought for peanuts off low mileage imported JDM cars.


Good branded suspension are getting increasingly rare for Gen2. i am just looking to exercise my options as i have had my Tein Super Streets for i think 2 years now... and i have no intent to rebuild them if(or rather, when) they start leaking. But Spuds, gg back to the Evo X suspension thingy, the rears will fit right? What about the fronts? Just curious!

Damn you are lucky to get them Ohlins. Are these the PCV ones from japan?

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 Post subject: Re: Evo X suspension
PostPosted: 29 Mar 2013 23:23 
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Fronts don't fit the top mounts are wromg and you can't just swap them because the piston rod is larger diameter.

I looked at trying to redrill my strut towers or making up an adaptor plate etc but the PCD of the top mount bolts is such that they fall right on the raised lip of the main hole in the strut top. It could be done but I decided it wasn't worth the effort and sold them.

HHMS sell quality Bilstein coilovers suitable for Gen1/2 not the usual bling rubbish everyone seems to fit (that fail frighteningly quickly). HHMS ran the works back S1600 Satria on the British rally championship on behalf of Proton, they know their stuff. Scroll down for rears - http://hh-ms.com/parts-catalogue/?SelCa ... egoryID=12, fronts are listed under 1400 for some reason.

Or try AVO - http://www.avouk.com/

Or Gaz - http://www.gazshocks.com/

Or if your pockets are deeper Proflex - http://www.proflexuk.com/

I know all of these will do coilovers for Gen1/2 - they may not have them listed on their sites but they do do them - give them a call.


What is PCV?


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 Post subject: Re: Evo X suspension
PostPosted: 30 Mar 2013 00:12 
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Location: Singapore
Country: Singapore
Sack of Spuds wrote:
What is PCV?


To what i know, its a type of valving design, just like what DFV is. But i think substantially different. Think of it as the predecessor of the DFV.

Marketed primarily for the japanese market, which uses genuine Ohlins parts but assembled in japan.

Here's a link for ya if you can understand japanese LOL (I dun)

http://ohlins.czj.jp/auto/Technology/PCV.html

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 Post subject: Re: Evo X suspension
PostPosted: 30 Mar 2013 00:26 
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Samurai Blues wrote:
Sack of Spuds wrote:
What is PCV?


To what i know, its a type of valving design, just like what DFV is. But i think substantially different. Think of it as the predecessor of the DFV.

Marketed primarily for the japanese market, which uses genuine Ohlins parts but assembled in japan.

Here's a link for ya if you can understand japanese LOL (I dun)

http://ohlins.czj.jp/auto/Technology/PCV.html



I don't understand japanese, but google does.

Looks like separate control of high speed and low speed damping as per 3 and 4 way adjustable shocks.

But not sure what I have would have to try to decipher the writing on the side.

I set is from an EVO IV I have the fronts only fitted (with OE EVO IV springs) and they seem fantastic but do raise the front up , no bad thing on a rally car. The other set are form an EVO 3 the rears are destined for the car but with Proton/Colt springs fitted, the fronts have EVO 3 lowering springs fitted so I intend trying these as a smooth tarmac event set up, though I suspect they may be too high spring rate even for that (265 lbin IIRC) but will give them a try. All of them are 1 way adjustable damping, fixed spring platforms - but I don't have access to corner weight scales so coilovers would be rather pointless.


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 Post subject: Re: Evo X suspension
PostPosted: 30 Mar 2013 17:26 
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Location: Singapore
Country: Singapore
Sack of Spuds wrote:
I set is from an EVO IV I have the fronts only fitted (with OE EVO IV springs) and they seem fantastic but do raise the front up , no bad thing on a rally car. The other set are form an EVO 3 the rears are destined for the car but with Proton/Colt springs fitted, the fronts have EVO 3 lowering springs fitted so I intend trying these as a smooth tarmac event set up, though I suspect they may be too high spring rate even for that (265 lbin IIRC) but will give them a try. All of them are 1 way adjustable damping, fixed spring platforms - but I don't have access to corner weight scales so coilovers would be rather pointless.


So Ohlins coilovers have OE springs? Not bad on a rally car? Hmmm you participate in rally events?
Hmmmm i am not really concerned wif corner weighing... i m just the average guy who wants decent suspension, go abit lower and enjoy abit of speed through the winding roads... :D

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 Post subject: Re: Evo X suspension
PostPosted: 31 Mar 2013 00:33 
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Samurai Blues wrote:
Sack of Spuds wrote:
I set is from an EVO IV I have the fronts only fitted (with OE EVO IV springs) and they seem fantastic but do raise the front up , no bad thing on a rally car. The other set are form an EVO 3 the rears are destined for the car but with Proton/Colt springs fitted, the fronts have EVO 3 lowering springs fitted so I intend trying these as a smooth tarmac event set up, though I suspect they may be too high spring rate even for that (265 lbin IIRC) but will give them a try. All of them are 1 way adjustable damping, fixed spring platforms - but I don't have access to corner weight scales so coilovers would be rather pointless.


So Ohlins coilovers have OE springs? Not bad on a rally car? Hmmm you participate in rally events?
Hmmmm i am not really concerned wif corner weighing... i m just the average guy who wants decent suspension, go abit lower and enjoy abit of speed through the winding roads... :D


No my Ohlins aren't coilovers.

Unless you are going to have the car corner weighted coilovers are just bling. Equally good suspension is available without the cost of all the bits that go into making a coilover. If you want lower get shorter springs, if you want to go really low get a complete shorter strut body, thats where the likes of AVO are good, they will build you what you wnat not just sell you a one size (doesn't) fit all solution.

Yes mine is used for what are called road rallies in the UK, mixed surface events held on public and private roads at night. Protons are really popular at the moment as they are pretty cheap to buy and decent performance out of the box, people spend £'000s GBP just to get other cars up to the speed of a standard Satria GTi, my and a handful of other Mivec transplants is just the next step on.

For fast road use I wouldn't lower the car more than about 25-35mm which can be achieved with lowering springs, and a set of standard EVO struts and shocks will be more than adequate - coilover will just mean you spends loads for no gain except boasting rights at the bar and they will inevitably fail after a year or two as any decent coilover needs servicing regularly and no one ever does as you need to send them back to an agent for the manufacturer usually. How many people have you read about having Tein and BC suspension start making noises etc. The standard Bilstein set up on some of the later EVOs (might only be the UK only FQ range though) are excellent for fast road. Brand new fronts are £176 GBP each on UK ebay - they don't go straight on but the mods needed are simple enough.

A coilover is NOT intrinsically better than a fixed platform spring except that you can change the ride height but in reality - who really does that after the first couple of weeks.


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 Post subject: Re: Evo X suspension
PostPosted: 03 Apr 2013 07:16 
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Joined: 10 May 2007 05:20
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Location: Singapore
Country: Singapore
Sack of Spuds wrote:
Samurai Blues wrote:
Sack of Spuds wrote:
I set is from an EVO IV I have the fronts only fitted (with OE EVO IV springs) and they seem fantastic but do raise the front up , no bad thing on a rally car. The other set are form an EVO 3 the rears are destined for the car but with Proton/Colt springs fitted, the fronts have EVO 3 lowering springs fitted so I intend trying these as a smooth tarmac event set up, though I suspect they may be too high spring rate even for that (265 lbin IIRC) but will give them a try. All of them are 1 way adjustable damping, fixed spring platforms - but I don't have access to corner weight scales so coilovers would be rather pointless.


So Ohlins coilovers have OE springs? Not bad on a rally car? Hmmm you participate in rally events?
Hmmmm i am not really concerned wif corner weighing... i m just the average guy who wants decent suspension, go abit lower and enjoy abit of speed through the winding roads... :D


No my Ohlins aren't coilovers.

Unless you are going to have the car corner weighted coilovers are just bling. Equally good suspension is available without the cost of all the bits that go into making a coilover. If you want lower get shorter springs, if you want to go really low get a complete shorter strut body, thats where the likes of AVO are good, they will build you what you wnat not just sell you a one size (doesn't) fit all solution.

Yes mine is used for what are called road rallies in the UK, mixed surface events held on public and private roads at night. Protons are really popular at the moment as they are pretty cheap to buy and decent performance out of the box, people spend £'000s GBP just to get other cars up to the speed of a standard Satria GTi, my and a handful of other Mivec transplants is just the next step on.

For fast road use I wouldn't lower the car more than about 25-35mm which can be achieved with lowering springs, and a set of standard EVO struts and shocks will be more than adequate - coilover will just mean you spends loads for no gain except boasting rights at the bar and they will inevitably fail after a year or two as any decent coilover needs servicing regularly and no one ever does as you need to send them back to an agent for the manufacturer usually. How many people have you read about having Tein and BC suspension start making noises etc. The standard Bilstein set up on some of the later EVOs (might only be the UK only FQ range though) are excellent for fast road. Brand new fronts are £176 GBP each on UK ebay - they don't go straight on but the mods needed are simple enough.

A coilover is NOT intrinsically better than a fixed platform spring except that you can change the ride height but in reality - who really does that after the first couple of weeks.


Wouldnt shortened springs on OEM struts and shocks *even if they are evo* give you a bouncy ride? I dun wanna be riding on a pogo stick... and not to mention they premature wears down the struts too won't they?

I have had Tein HAs meant for a CA(Gen1) from my mate's Satria GTi which he used for 5 years and then sold them to be for... about 200 quid. Them coilovers had a hard life in his car lol. No leaks. I had the top mounts changed and then used them on my car for 2 years. They don't make them like they used to. Then i bought Super Streets... they been on my car for 2 years now. Still ok, but the front left strut piston shaft broke into 2 barely 2 weeks after i had them fitted on. The local Tein dealer refused to warrant me, and then i had to pay abt 200 quid to have them rebuild it which really pissed me off. My SS were supposed to have 16 clicks but after the rebuild, that particular one which broke got to 21. So i have had enough of Teins really. Ohlins have captured my heart lol but they are waaaaaaaaaay to expensive.

Havng said that, i agree with you; nobody messes with ride height after the first couple of weeks lol. Actually come to think of it. KW Variant1 dun seem too bad.....

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 Post subject: Re: Evo X suspension
PostPosted: 03 Apr 2013 13:29 
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Samurai Blues wrote:
Wouldnt shortened springs on OEM struts and shocks *even if they are evo* give you a bouncy ride? I dun wanna be riding on a pogo stick... and not to mention they premature wears down the struts too won't they?


EVO struts especially 7/8/9 are designed for a much much heavier car -they are more than amply damped for any Gen1/Gen2, perhaps even overly. \i wouldn't suggest |cut down, but rather proper lowering ones or even custom ones if you can't find what you need off the shelf.


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